Army Surplus Store Idea

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Army Surplus Store Idea

I already made a working shop and currently its inventory consist "only" on:

- Canvas backpacks;
- duffel basg;
- water purification tablets;
- Electronic water testers;
- flashlights;
- rifle scopes;
- binoculars;
- rifle shoulder straps;
- night vision goggles (and specific battery);
- gas masks (and working cartridges);
- compound bows (and professional arrows);
- sleeping bags (still undecided about adding both variants or only the better "pharaoh" one);
- multitools;
- tactical gear (gloves, balaclava, viper boots, helmet and armor).

"And the actual weapons?", one could ask, well..that's what I would like some opinions about.

Judging on what the reality of the city seems to be, would it be really that simple, for a perfect stranger coming from "outside the walls", to buy fire arms?
One could bribe the vendor, sure, but my concern is also, how much, or badly, would such "store" do, to the balance of the game?

Some of the items I listed aren't really that difficult to find, and some others (like armor and weapons) are just expensive enough to be considerable even beneficial to the game (as a money sink for late game players).
The same though, cannot be said about the gas mask cartridges, very rare and quite useful to scavenge the black swamp (as well as avoiding nasty blue disease..), and other minor things that could potentially lead to a milder game experience, too simple and planned to offer a challenge anymore.

Another issue, instead, would come from a "realism" point of view.
For example, one would expect to find much more gear inside a store of that kind, like:

- tents (at least a cheap one and a more advanced one);
- an actual fire starter (like those steel magnesium rods);
- MREs (Military Emergency Rations);
- self defense devices (pepper spray, tasers, etc etc )

and so on.

But I would prefer to find a more "vanilla friendly" solution, instead of adding so much new stuff. Otherwise keeping the game balanced would become a much harder objective.
Besides, I am not sure how possible would e to make new item icons with a graphic style close enough to the original game one.
That said though, I am not completely opposite a fully fledged mod, in case a proper one would arise.

And that's all. I hope to hear many constructive opinions.

I personally, don't really like the idea of an all-out shopping spree being available inside the DMC. As you yourself mentioned, the reality of that place (being walled-off, self sufficient and mercantilist(-ic?) in nature), they must have a strict control over their goods dispensation. And the fact that they limit entries/exits, plus ID-ing and tracking the citizens and visitors, it's not hard to imagine rather tightly controlled market in there.

To make any sense of already existing shops in there, as well as of a newly added one in my mod, I used following explanation: The DMC prohibits any trade with the outsiders (to prevent loss of resources and remove the possibility of strangers "intorducing" dangerous stuff to the close eco-system - just imagine if all citizens were able to buy unlimited arms from outsiders, or even better - Bob's Bricks :D ).

The only exceptions to that rule are foodstuffs and medical supplies, mainly to keep the public health as not-affected as possible (bands of starving, diseased bums would have a negative impact on that factor) - it's hardly a resource problem since they clone food. To buy anything else, one needs to identify as a full citizen (they have their tracking devices as well, in a form of a chip in their hands).

So you're walking into a store and wanting to buy a gun/hover bike? No problem! Just wave your hand over a sensor, press "OK" on the console and the transaction is complete. Weird homeless dudes trying to barter a, still bleeding, piece of meat for a new laptop are not served at all. Simple and elegant.

So any non-food/medicine trade in the city, in that scenario, needs by definition be on the black market - allowing for some, more interesting, scenarios.

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It's a nice idea. Maybe, for fluff, the store owner could be an ex-skycorps who still has contacts to "supply" him merchandise.
To avoid, or at least mitigate balance issues, the store could sell 2nd grade or old refurbished gear, weaker and less durable than standard DMC equipment. That way maybe even sidearms could br for sale. Sure, it would mean creating a bunch of new items, but at least keeps the motivation for ambushing guards outside the city for their loot.


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Yeah, Kaaven, you covered exactly the points I was considering in the back of my mind.
And I as well have come to the conclusion the the most "lore-friendly" solution, would be to add a "black market".
Maybe to unlock with a costly "admission fee", or a side quest, like recovering a particular expensive item (dogman coat, nano medkit charges, etc) or a set number other items.

Even then though, I think its inventory should be randomized. And by that I mean no 100% chance to find full set of armor and a military shotgun all the times, like a proper shop would have. But that's also a completely arbitrary decision, so I wont insist further on it.

I've instead been thinking about the "knock off vendor", mentioned on the concrete apartment description, as the one introducing the player to this black market.

This is something I thought would be fun, but decided against it and was planning more on a black market method, military gear would be possible, but it would likely be worn/degraded and not common, it was how I was going to implement some of my non craftable gear.

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I've given much thought lately, and after paying more attention to what the city's policy seems to have toward "visitors rights", I noticed 2 main things:

- first, I haven't yet found a direct hint that, who comes from outside the wall can't buy something or receive some service (but I am completely ready to be proven wrong, in case I missed some parts of lore);

- in second place, the hospital is described as having a "mercenary attitude toward clientele", meaning I suppose, it can offer whatever he wants to anyone with enough money to buy it. Leaving the possibility that someone else could decide to do the same.

Now, for game balance's sake, I agree with not adding shops able to sell anything a "neo scavenger may desire", but would be reasonable to think that some stores, may be more inclined to sell a limited selection of goods, even to homeless coming from the "Sprawl".
What do you think about it?

My main idea is still an army surplus store from which one would be able to buy some of the more rare items, like professional arrows and gas mask cartridges.

I am also thinking about using the "knockoff vendor" as a dealer of cracking software and UVDs, but that's a different matter.

I too can't imagine a proper in-lore way to add actual heavy duty military weapons to a store inside the heavily policed DMC. In fact I can't imagine passing through the gates again when leaving DMC with your new DMC armor and weapons and not having everything seized plus earning a permanent ban. ;) I can't imagine how the DMC guards are supposed to maintain control if anyone with enough bucks can buy their equipment. A black market store outside DMC that specifically deals in army equipment makes much more sense to me, though again, I'd move it away from the sprawl and "hide it" well in some way, to explain why the roaming DMC guards aren't making short order of it.

But things like cartridges and backpacks (yes), gas masks (maybe), arrows (a stretch) would be more easily explainable even within DMC. Basically all other stuff you list sound to me like they'd be much less problematic than the actual tactical gear and any firearms. Not perfectly vanilla as I personally understand the game, but close enough. ;) So yeah, I think you could maybe get away with something like a "camping equipment" store, provided everything is insanely overpriced and at least some of the better items are available only rarely. XD

That said, I'm very much in favour of the "this is your mod, do whatever you like" concept. :) Mull it over in your head, and if you still want it, make up a way to explain it that makes sense to you.

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i wouldn't mind being able to buy duffel bags and other items. however they should only appear in shop with a %10 chance because 1) money is easy 2) it'll keep it exciting

lore wise it doesn't make sense that they would stop making bags

as for weapons, perhaps make it a 1% chance

just make everything have a 10% chance and guns 1%

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