Food Analysis

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Food Analysis

So, I have been trying to figure out what is the best food source to carry around given I've worked towards being able to buy food. But what is the best thing to carry given variables such as:

- Value of the item (if purchasing)
- Weight of the item (to avoid becoming Burdened)
- Volume of the item (to cram as much into a tile as possible)

So, between going in game, checking the wiki (some of which is inaccurate), and examining the XML file, I created a spreadsheet, compared food items based on type. You can find this here:

And here are my summarized findings:

- Presuming that Rehydration and Micronutrition provides 100% (I didn't let myself go down to near-death to find out), your Food meter is 168 points, and your Water meter is 72 points.

- Out of all the Organic foods (foods that decay), Medium Chunk of Meat gives the greatest food per tile at maximum stack (8) as well as the greatest overall increase (48). It also grants more hydration than water (6 vs 4). Mushrooms come next per tile at maximum stack (2.5). Kilo for Kilo, however, Berries and Mushrooms tie as the greatest food granted per Kg (20 per Kg).

- Corn-a-Cola grants Food and Water (3 and 1 respectively) at the low-low price of $1 (not including bottle). This is the cheapest food-per-dollar you can get. Soup grants slightly more (4 food, 2 water) for $5 and is considered a liquid, so you can pour it inside bottles you've found. This isn't as cost-effective, but it is caffeine-free.

- The best thing to put in a bottle for food? Gelli Bears. One bottle holds 6 stacks of 5 bears for a total of 30. Each bear grants 0.5 food, meaning a full bottle grants 15 food. This costs $60 and weighs 0.6 Kg. An alternative, one soup and 10 bears in a bottle, grants 9 food and 2 water. This costs only $25 and weighs 0.55 Kg.

- As was stated in the Wiki, Ketchup grants the greatest food per complete stack (5), and its weight puts it on par with Gelli Bears. It cannot be bottled (go figure), but this lack of volume reduction does not diminish its value, as its stacking ability makes it superior to Gelli Bears (40 units of ketchup in 4 tiles loose compared to 30 units of bears in 4 tiles bottled). Both items grant 0.5 food per unit.

- Crackers are the lightest food you can carry, granting 100 food per Kg. Provided you can find water to make up for its dehydrating effects, if you are more concerned with weight than volume you can't do any better than this. Gelli Bears and Ketchup both tie as the runner up at 25 food per Kg.

- Crackers and Ketchup cannot be purchased in the C-Store, making Gelli Bears the most convenient stock-up food for characters loaded with cash.

- What should eat once you reach DMC? Stay away from the Diner. All of the meals give the same amount of food and hydration, and after tip give you the worst replenishment for your dollar. Chow down on Tofu Sticks instead if you are on a budget. They give you 1.67 food and 0.33 water per dollar (5 food and 1 water total for $3). The runner up is either of the Meat & Vegetable platters from the same place at 1.40 food and 0.40 water per dollar. Rehydration & Micronutrition comes in next at 0.92 food and 0.39 water per dollar.

- Berries actually give the best value for your dollar, giving 2 food per dollar at 100% condition. But they cannot be purchased en masse. Ketchup and Gelli Bears give you the worst value for your dollar at 0.25 food per dollar.

- Of course, you can't beat free, and Zom Zom's offers some perfectly acceptable 4-point "veal" for the low-low price of zero. You'll have to eat it 42 times to go from empty to full.

Some other interesting trivia I found...

- Tannin Tea does not offer any hydration. Tannin Tea invokes a condition that adds 1 point of hydration instead of directly hydrating. It's also valuable to sell in the Junk Market.

- Again: Chicken, Shrimp, and Burger all give the same benefit. Same for Meat & Cabbage vs. Meat & Sprouts.



- Eat only Tofu Sticks in DMC. Best VALUE. Bring or buy water if needed.

- Chicken, Shrimp, and Burgers at the Diner all give the same benefit despite different costs. Don't waste your money.

- If you're REALLY on a budget, drink lots of Corn-a-Cola. It restores hunger, too. Mind the caffeine.

- Crackers are the best to stack if you are concerned about WEIGHT, but they dehydrate you.

- Ketchup is the best to stack if you are concerned about VOLUME.

- Gelli Bears inside of Bottles are the best to stack if you have a lot of MONEY and want to quickly pack up to explore.

- Ketchup and Gelli Bears do NOT hydrate. Bring water.

- Medium Chunk of Meat gives you the most sustenance for its volume. Ketchup falls in second.

- Soup can be poured inside bottles.

- Tannin Tea does NOT hydrate; sell it instead.

So, there ya go! :) Hope this infodump is helpful. A little groggy while finishing this up, so hopefully no errors.

Very, very helpful. Answers a lot of questions that I was too lazy to answer myself. Thanks much.

That is quite interesting. In fact, I'd suspect hat a few items should be somewhat balanced now that we see side-by-side comparison.

I think better way and faster is Haggerty clinic option if it means for DMC ;p

It's very cost-effective, true, moreso than diner food, but it's also very expensive at $183. You have to be missing a large chunk of hunger/hydration to really take advantage of its cost-effectiveness, and at that point you're probably suffering hunger and thirst penalties to abilities and movement. It certainly is the fastest though, so if you're literally swimming in cash and feeling lazy or in a hurry, the clinic will happily take your money. :)

Tannin Tea may not hydrate, but it provides a lot of other benefits. I always keep a bottle or two on me, but I often do make it purely for bankrolling other things.

Other tips for making money:

Turn broken bottles into shards, the broken bottle is worth $0.05, the 2 shards you get from it are worth $0.25 each.

Turn shards into shivs, use dirty rags to do it. Shards are worth $0.25 at 100% condition and dirty rags have no value, Shivs are worth $5 at 100%. Get rags by tearing up all those t-shirts, at 100% a shirt is worth $4 but will give you 5 rags and some string which could give you $25 worth of shivs.

Don't use whiskey bottles to carry water around if you have a choice, they weigh a lot more than plastic bottles (.58kg vs .05kg). Turn them into shivs instead, $1.50 bottle = $10 in shivs.

I noticed that when I was playing last night. It's odd how a broken bottle is worth less than a completely smashed up bottle.

And agreed on the Tea. My observation was more to make sure players are aware that the tea should only be used for its medicinal benefits, and should not be relied upon as a source of hydration. There were a couple such surprises (Corn-a-cola as food, no hydration from ketchup, etc).

I hardly ever comment here, but damn, great work. :) I always love reading game mechanic details like this one. It would be useful included in the wiki, maybe submit it or reach out to someone who can? Again, thanks a lot.

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10 Ways (not) to Die - A beginner's guide

Done. :) The wiki should now be accurate.

What do you mean with Tannin Tea does not hydrate? My character is a tea junkie and consumes nothing else that that and it hydrates very well. It might not be very efficient, because i have to drink several liters to get from yellow tofull, but who cares, it's infinite and super healthy!

Of course tanin tea does hydrate a little, though it is in fact a very minor amount. Guys must have missed that when reading the XML file.

Not only that, in previous version it had a stacking bug, as it given you a health boost that never went away, making you health-super-god ;D

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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My current character doesn't have Botany, so I'm unable to do an in-game test, but this is what the game data contains:

Spoiler: Highlight to view
&lt;table name="conditions"&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="id"&gt;163&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="strName"&gt;Drank tannin tea&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="strDesc"&gt;&lt;us&gt; drank some tannin tea.&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="aFieldNames"&gt;m_fImmuneRestoreRate,m_fImmuneLeft&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="aModifiers"&gt;0.001,0.1&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="aEffects"&gt;&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bFatal"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="vIDNext"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="fDuration"&gt;4&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bPermanent"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="vChanceNext"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bStackable"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bDisplay"&gt;1&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bDisplayOther"&gt;1&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="nColor"&gt;2&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bResetTimer"&gt;1&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bRemoveAll"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;
&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;column name="bRemovePostCombat"&gt;0&lt;/column&gt;

There is no FoodDebt or WaterDebt modifications, so I can only presume that it has no effect on these attributes. If it does in-game, then something other than game data is affecting hydration, and this will have a serious impact on the accuracy of my data.

Alright, I think I found it. In Use Conditions for the item (which I presume applies a condition), there is "Minor Thirst Quench" which reduces WaterDebt by 1. This suddenly becomes a headache, as now I have to check the item and the conditions it applies, not just check the condition itself. ARGH!

Anyone good at coding know how to write a modding parsing tool that can decipher those numbers and create plain-english links to what does what? :/ I'll update my spreadsheet and the wiki after I get home from work today.

Looking closer, it appears that Tannin Tea applies the "Disinfect" condition, on what I guess is certain slots? Wound slots? Could someone confirm that Tannin Tea can be used in this manner?

Yeah, it can be used on the wounds (all kinds, although only open wounds can be infected as far as I know) in a similar fashion to the way Whiskey works.

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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Alright, after sorting through Use Conditions, it looks like the Tannin Tea is the only discrepancy. Unusual that instead of using the WaterDebt field it causes a secondary condition that replenishes hydration. Either way, updated the spreadsheet, and I'll look over the wiki to make sure that's all accurate too.

Done. If anyone notices anything else that's off, please let me know. :)

Tannin tea used to act like this in older versions:

<table name="conditions"> <column name="id">163</column> <column name="strName">Drank tannin tea</column> <column name="strDesc">&lt;us&gt; drank some tannin tea.</column> <column name="aFieldNames">m_fImmuneRestoreRate,fWaterDebt,m_fImmuneLeft</column> <column name="aModifiers">0.001,-1,0.1</column> <column name="aEffects"></column> <column name="bFatal">0</column> <column name="vIDNext">0</column> <column name="fDuration">0</column> <column name="bPermanent">1</column> <column name="vChanceNext">0</column> <column name="bStackable">0</column> <column name="bDisplay">1</column> <column name="bDisplayOther">1</column> <column name="nColor">2</column> <column name="bResetTimer">1</column> <column name="bRemoveAll">0</column> <column name="bRemovePostCombat">0</column> </table>

It did it all at once, but that had the unintended result of giving you permanent boosts to those immune system stats. It would stack too, so if you drank much tea you'd have an invincible immune system before long. So the boosts were separated into two conditions to properly give a permanent water debt refill but only a temporary immune system boost. Corn-a-Cola is set up a similar way, one condition for permanent water and food debt refill, another condition for a limited duration caffeine high.

Aah, gotcha. That explains the separation for those two items. :)