[WIP] Extended NeoScav v3.2 (Archived Comments)

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Yeah, well it was a crude 1 minute copy-paste job after all. :p

BTW why are you looping around your vAlsoTry recipes? (first->last->first) Doesn't it create an infinite loop? And if there is some safety mechanism that prevents double checking of recipes what purpose dose it serve anyway?

It was because of another weirdness with modding. I remember I was having problems with mulligan stew only using the first recipe and I did a lot of stuff to make it work, including the loop thing. I have no idea what of all things fixed the issue but I left it like that and moved on. :P

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Mkay, I just uploaded a fix patch with the following changes:

-Raw chunks of fat can now be eaten.
-Removed the price from disassembled weapons since it can be used to sell damaged weapons at good prices.
-Fixed the size of the new soup since the previous update failed to do so.
-Small and medium length of String degrade now.
-Rifle shoulder strap has been renamed to military shoulder strap and it doesn't degrade now.
-Increased the chances to find tool kits because they were too rare.

The next update of this mod will introduce craftable but weaker versions of the military shoulder strap and it will also re introduce the old leather tanning/making and all related features.

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Erm... I just uploaded yet another quick fix. I found a couple of issues with two moves, the hiding versions of Advance and Fall Back Under Cover. It's all fixed now.

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Day off today so I had enough time to release a new update. It includes:

-Leather crafting is back into the mod. All leather items can be crafted with small changes to their recipes.
-Added a new leather item, Leather Shoulder Straps. Unlike string rope straps, these will always be crafted at 100% and degrade slower.
-Re introduced the DMC Pistol Holster. I made a small inventory change in it so the AI put their pistols in it.
-Made it so the Urban Dogeman T-shirt is less rare.
-There's a small chance for Bad Muthas to spawn with a Leather Vest.
-Tool kits were still too rare so I increased the chances to find them a bit more.
-Cleaned the xml files a bit of unnecessary data. This could affect saved games.

There are now 3 different Shoulder Straps in the game and I'm planning on changing some recipes to use these instead of medium length of strings. That will be for later, though. Next thing is to bring back the combat moves like Taunt, Lure Away and the grappling/struggling combat mechanics.

Also, I won't bring back the Medkit w/strap coz I never really liked it. They will require that new "size" for items so the kit is not overpowered and that's a lot of copy/paste work. :P

Edit: I think the grappling could use some new moves. I'll think about new ones... suggestions are welcomed. :3

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About the combat move you could add a proper sneak move wich would allow for player with the sneak trait to get closer to enemies and kill them with another move like a stealth kill I think this is one of the things that this game missed so if it is possible it would be very cool. Also a disarm move wouldn't be bad of course it should be limited to stronger characters with fight skills

Well, what I could do is to clone the sneak moves and make them more sneaky for players with the hidden skill. These would replace the original ones, of course, so the move selection is not littered with moves.

The closest thing that could be like a sneak kill move I could implement could be something like a melee surge but that could also throw the target to the ground with no chances to miss the attack. This one should be available for all characters.

I had the idea for a move to allow characters to go back to hiding in combat at will upon certain conditions but there's no way to force that. I will post a thread about it in the modding talk section. Maybe Dan has a trick for something like that.

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But on a serious note I think a move where you throw dirt into enemy eyes to blind them for a moment would be cool. For example, when you are fallen and enemy is right next to you, you blind your enemy to gain enough time to get up safely.

It could give them the Stunned and Vulnerable conditions for a turn. Also, maybe this should be available to all but characters with Tough, Strong or Melee skills since this is something someone with no fighting skills in them would do.

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Hmm... I just noticed a little issue with leather crafting. Making a leather item will also return 3 small strings to you for some reason. It's not that bad, just a bit weird.

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Mkay, time for a little update:

-Addressed some small and unworthy to mention issues introduced in the previous version.
-Added improved versions of some hidden moves for those using the hiding skill. These new moves are less likely to alert enemies of your presence.
-Added a new move, Sneak Attack. It's a move that never misses and it's only available if you are in the melee range of your equipped weapon while hidden. It will strike the target twice and stun them.
-Taunt move is back. This is basically the opposite of the Threaten move, and will make the target less likely to run from you.
-Lure Away move is back. Can only be done while hidden and in a certain range. It will distract the target and make them move 1 space away from you.
-Added a new move, A handful for an Eye. It can only be done while fallen and by characters without the strong and melee skill. The move will stun the target and make them retreat 1 space away from you. It can also be used while recovering. Hopefully, this will give Melonheads a bit more of an advantage against the stronger characters.

Check the main page for more information!

I know I said I was gonna work on bringing back the "Wrestling" moves but I felt like I could release these ones first. Wrestling moves next, I promise. :3

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Yay more fightin times! Oh chiko even if it's not a grapple move the thing I miss most is the ability to instakill unconscious enemies, simply because I hate wasting energy trying to get that murder hit in.

Also I haven't had internet because of the new apartment. So I think I'll try downloading this stuff to try it out.

I was wondering where you went. :P
I haven't done any changes to the main files so installing the mod is the same business than it was before.

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Managed to get the grappling moves done today since it's holiday and I had nothing else to do besides watching netflix with my friends and drink beer so yeah, new update:

-A handful for an Eye now has a cooldown to prevent characters from using it right after it was already used.
-Grappling moves are back. Most of them are just like they were in the old version of this mod.
-Struggle now has different names depending on the role when used. Struggle Hit for Grappler and Struggle Back for Grappled.
-Struggle Back can also be used while being held back.
-Takedown makes moderate bruising instead of minor bruising.

As always, more information in the main page!

I won't be bringing back the Canned Grenade any time soon since it require a hack that I don't like because it affects melee attacks so with this update I officially finished porting this mod to the new version of the game. Yay!

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Uhhh Chiko your wizardry gave condition modifiers to pebbles. Seems a little odd IMO. Also not quite sure how I feel about string having condition modifiers now. What's the reasoning for this change?

I just checked and pebbles actually do have condition since they degrade when used. This also means you will find already degraded ones lying around.

Also, the reason string degrades now is because of the new shoulder straps. Vanilla shoulder strap used to degrade and since you could just use medium string as an alternative, which can be obtained really easily, it rendered shoulder straps useless.

Small String degrades the fastest, followed by Medium String and then the new String Rope, which is the weakest of the craftable shoulder straps. String cannot be recovered from reverse crafting now.

String Rope and the better shoulder straps can be recovered from reverse crafting. The military shoulder strap, which can only be looted does not degrade and can be used in all recipes that need medium strings. So basically, it's some kind of rebalance.

With this in mind, if you are using makeshift equipment like the tarp pack, it's a good idea to always carry string with you coz when it breaks, only the tarp will remain and you will need to make medium string again to recraft it. Or if you have lots of string, you could craft 5 string rope so when one breaks, the others will still be able to be used again.

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While this makes sense, it also makes the Travois nearly useless because the string deteriorates so quickly that it will only last for a few turns. Also, because the recipes tend to take the lower end of durabilities in my experience, you'll rarely be able to craft one that has any measure of durability. It might make more sense to increase the life time of the pieces (if they are not being used, it makes no sense that they fall apart) or to only give the rope sling a level of durability. I really am enjoying this mod thus far and I actually registered just to say this. Keep up the good work, but I definitely feel like this change may not be necessary.

What I could do right now is to make it so string rope always spawns at 100% condition. I just find it unrealistic to use string as shoulder straps for rifles and crowbars or to hold together heavy stuff like a Travois.

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That would also make sense in the way that someone who is weaving a piece of rope would not consider it made if it was about to break.

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
DeviantArt Gallery of MoD Sprites

Would you mind if I borrowed that idea (or some spin on it) to add it to the M(m)MoD? Cause it does make a lot of sense and seems like it would fit in nicely.

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
DeviantArt Gallery of MoD Sprites

Go ahead. The stuff in here is free to use in other mods. :3

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Quick patch, just uploaded into the main page. It changes:

-String Rope Shoulder Strap renamed to String Rope.
-String Rope will always spawn at 100% when crafted.
-Leather Shoulder Strap renamed to Leather Strap.
-String Rope, Leather Strap and Military Shoulder Strap can be stacked to up to 10x.

Something I should mention is that crafting rope will also spawn 3 small string for some reason. This is a known issue that happens because of the way I use to spawn items at 100% condition. This issue should be no more after the next game update, which will give us an official way to spawn items at full condition regardless of the condition of their ingredients.

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So I have been trying the mod to find bugs and I have noticed some curious things and situations.

1-Sum guy grappled me and after a while struggling, he managed to knock my weapons out of my hands. He then pushed me away and started to fight me normally. The IA is a bit random when it comes to using fighting moves but this situation was notable. Good thing they aren't advanced enough to pick up weapons in combat.

2-Enemies will sometimes grapple you while you are asleep and proceed to strangle you. This is very dangerous and there was one time I got strangled to death because of this.

3-If you are being held back while grappled and there is another enemy at melee range, you can use head butt or leg trip on them instead of the one holding you back. This was an unintended feature but I will not "fix" it because I don't think there's anything wrong with that, actually.

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Okay, I've been playing with it and it seems a bit better but the problem I have is that string durability is still an issue because making medium string from small string will destroy it's durability. I have a pile of small string that is at 96% and trying to make a piece of medium string only has a condition of 3.9%. As a result, anything I make will fall apart. It might be best to see if you can add durability only to the sling thing itself because this is getting slightly out of hand with the travois. Also, I can't make a leather patch using two water, ashes, bark solution and a small chunk of fur from a dogman when I use a tin can. Do I need a pot or does dogman fur not work?

Leather works, I just had some problems with it. That said, the string durability is an issue.

This is why you should use string rope instead. As I mentioned before, I find it really unrealistic to use just tied string to hold heavy stuff together. It doesn't take much effort to craft string rope either. Alternatively, you can also use military shoulder straps or leather straps as replacement but those will be available later in the game, specially leather straps.

This naturally means a proper Travois is no longer as easy to get early in the game as it used to and you will find yourself ripping clothes apart for string a lot.

Also, small chunks of dogman fur should work... Imma check it and see if I did something wrong there.

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I guess the string rope being stackable makes it a little better but you still need like two stacks of string rope for the Travoise. It's just weird because of all the aforementioned issues of making string into more string being problematic due to it always using the lowest value since string from clothes always has the value of the clothes, which I find odd ass the string should be salvageable at higher conditions from the clothes.

Hmmm... forgot about clothes transferring the condition to string. I can fix that like I did with the string rope.

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Yeah, that would be perfect. It's just a tad annoying when you collect all this stuff and then the travois or bag comes out at 1.3% durability because of one damaged string, which you can't even sort out of the pile. Thanks for looking into this, the mod is really coming along nicely.

You can actually sort out stacked items, just click a pile of stuff while holding down the shift button. This is only a good idea if you want a Medium String in good condition, though because string condition doesn't matter now when crafting String Rope.

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Whoops, double post. As another note though, I just wanted to say that this has added a lot to the game for me, I' going to try to do some leather crafting and see if I can make some stuff. Is the special gear slot the same as is used by the birch bag or is that a different space? Also, does the leather waterskin hold more water than a water bottle? I saw on the crafting grid that the space is the same, but I don't want to waste my leather on it if I can make something that is more useful. I'd also suggest seeing if you can make a recipe for a baked potato out of water and a fire source if possible. I may be dumb, but I've not found any recipes relating to potatoes as of now.

Yeah, it's the same slot.

And yeah, the waterskin is not a good alternative to bottles yet. I have in mind making it so it can store more but it's a bit weird putting two different liquids in a container. Maybe I can make it so it's two different waterskins in one or something like that.

The baked potato sounds like an ok recipe to add. Another recipe for potatoes could be french fries, which would also require either tallow or raw fat to make them.

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Small update, lads. It includes:

-New item, Berry Root. It can only be looted by those with the Botany Skill and can be used to make tea to help with vomiting, diarrhea and the first stage of cholera. You might need to drink a lot of this since it only has small chances to deal with each of the mentioned Status Effects. The effect does not stack either so it's best to drink some like every 2 turns.
-Fixed some issues with straps when crafting items using them with the hack to spawn items at 100% condition.
-Increased the inventory size of waterskins.

I decided to wait until the next update of the game to deal with getting string at full condition from clothes. There are too many cheap hacks in the mod already and the next game update means I will have to edit a ton of stuff and making mistakes since I tend to forget all of the changes I've made.

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I have something in mind but I think it would make Dogmen too dangerous. Grappling is only allowed for humans and Melonheads but I want to add Dogmen to it but give them deadly moves, along with other changes.

-Throw Down and Takedown moves cannot be done to dogmen because they are simply too big for humans.
-Dogmen will have an edited version of the Tackle move, which will be their way to start a grappling hold. If they miss they will fall to the ground alone but there will be a small chance to make you fall as well.
-Dogmen will have a different struggle move, which should deal cutting damage instead.
-Of all the grappling moves, Dogmen can only use Break Free, Throw Down and Gain Control.
-Dogmen can use a deadly Bite attack when you are fallen, vulnerable or both. This move will deal both bruising and cutting damage so it can break bones. Not always available if not in control of the grappling hold.

Also, I find it weird for dogmen to be able to kick someone while they are down so I will replace that with a bite attack which will technically be the same but will do cutting damage instead.

I've also thought about editing the bonus combat skills give... Having both the strong and melee skills allow characters to be deadly enough to insta cripple limbs or to even insta kill. Maybe I could tone that a bit down. This will naturally affect all characters, not just the player.

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I like this idea but for the takedown I think that even dogmen should be affected by them since a character with the strong and fight traits managed to kill one barehanded in the beginning

Hey Chiko. Found a weird glitch. I seem to be unable to place a handgun in campsites.

Woops. Forgot to add handguns in their inventory list. The sawoff is probably affected too. Imma fix that now.

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New small update:

-Added a new food item, Cooked Berries. It's basically Jam, but poorly made. As with Mulligan Stew, poisonous berries can be used as well so be careful.
-Made some changes provided by DnaJur, to the way Mulligan Stew Recipes works. This is unnoticeable for players and it won't affect saved games.
-Fixed the bug preventing Handguns and the Sawoff from being put in campsites.
-Unlike Soups and similar not totally liquid items, liquids like water could be put in campsites. I Removed that so those liquids need to be in a container to be able to be stay in campsites, just like the rest of the liquids.

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What's the difference between regular berries and the cooked variety?

The cooked one is liquid so it needs to be carried in containers. It will feed a bit more than the required berries, which is a stack of 5 berries, and will quench even more.

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Chiko you're doing a very dandy job with this.I think it's not even been 20 full days and you've almost updated all of the mods features,plus added some new thing,I like the cooked berries feature very much,I always wondered why we weren't able to cook them.And since I mentioned this,I have an idea regarding plants,Since you're so good at making textures,you could make some more plants?Carrots would be one thing,they could be cooked as well,also cut up with a blade to make small slices of them,some cabbage would also not hurt,just more plants in general.As for finding them you could add some sort of wild carrots,cabbage hexes,they should be similar to the "Open Field" tile you find in...open fields,like those tiles you should have a chance of finding berries,water but also add in the wild carrots,potatoes,cabbage in there.Just something to consider.(this would be a seperate finding method,other the the farm tiles in cities)

Thanks. I'm actually finished with the old stuff, though. The remaining features will not be back since they require too many hacks and vanilla changes.

About the more veggies. You can only find potatoes in farming plots so I'd like to add another veggie to be found in those like the carrots you mentioned.

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Update, lads! It includes:

-Cooked Berries will take a bit more time to prepare.
-Gas Mask filters can be taken out and put on the ground, campsites, bags, etc.
-Tackle cannot be done at 0 spaces since you would need a bit of room for something like that. It will also stop dogmen from doing it again and again at 0 range.
-New move for Dogmen, Bite. It replaces the Kick attack but it's similar. It does cutting damage instead and it has chances to make a second cutting damage but weaker.
-New lootable veggie, Carrots. They can be found in Farming Plots. Without Botany Skill you will find either a potato or carrots but with the skill and a bit of luck you could find more of both in a single looting attempt. These can be eaten raw or be used as ingredient for the Mulligan Stew.
-New food, Baked Potato. It's a bit better than eating a potato raw but it's really easy to make.
-New food, French Fries. You will need a Medium Heat Source, a Fire/Water proof container, a sharp edge, 4 potatoes and Tallow. You will get 2 stacks of 5 portions of fries. Decent food but will make you thirsty.

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Oh damn gonna download this. Pretty excited for the new stuff. Tried to make a Travoise out of your string strap thing Chiko and I think maybe it should cost less than ten medium string to make one since it requires 120 medium string to craft one. Not an easy feet given their rate of decay.

Also I'm no longer swimming in flour the moment I go outside so that's all fixed finally =D

Have you tried with leather straps? Remember you can make 4 straps out of a leather patch, which is more durable too. I usually make my Travois with a mix of rope and leather straps. Also, what about needing 8 med string to make them?

I could also make string rope and leather strap lootable items. Problem with this is they won't spawn at 100% condition.

That or I could add a recipe to turn rags into 1 or 2 small string or something like that.

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rags to string actually kinda makes sense. I end up leaving rags everywhere because I've had to rip up all the clothes I find for string. Also Why do foot wraps weigh more than boots? I'd think since they're just rags they'd be much lighter rather than weighing 150% of what boots weigh.

Wut. I never noticed that, I probably forgot to change the their weight since I usually use code from vanilla items to make the new ones. I will fix that now and add the rags to string recipe.

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Alright, small fix uploaded. It changes:

-Removed the "absorbant" property from animal hides and backpacks to prevent them from being used as rags.
-Fixed the wrong weight in footrags and adjusted the weight of headrags and handrags.
-Added a new recipe that allows you to turn 1x rags into 1x small string. Best to use Dirty Rags since the Clean ones will transfer their condition to the resulting strings.

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Yay Chiko! Also does this effect current saves? Because if not I might download it so I can get more string for all this leatherwork I'm doing. I've got so much animal hide I actually managed to slash up a bunch of leather and make a proper travois so now I'm worming on the armor. I also need just a few more things and I can full on just use the shopping cart since I just need the basket/boxes and the frame.

These kind of changes shouldn't corrupt saved games. The ones that do, usually are changes that remove bigger things like items, recipes and other things like that.

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Also, I've been unable to find carrots or berry roots even with Botany. Was there a mistake or are they just really really rare?

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