Cannibalism Nerf (Wendigo)

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Cannibalism Nerf (Wendigo)

With cannibalism, getting food is really easy without any repercussions. I propose something that would fit in with the supernatural events and current theme of Neo Scavenger. First, we change the name of meat coming from human corpses to human flesh and add a condition called Wendigo. Wendigo will have 4 levels (similar to poison). First level causes a craving for flesh, the player will have the "in pain" condition until they eat more human flesh, if they do not eat flesh the Wendigo condition goes away. The second level will cause the player to have an insatiable hunger that can only be quenched with human flesh, eating anything else will cause you to get even more hungrier. Third level will cause the player to be overheated, forcing them to remove their clothes. At level four you become a full fledged Wendigo and you lose your humanity, fueled by the need to eat human flesh.

At level 3, DMC and the junk market will show hostilities towards you and will not allow you to enter the hex.

On a side note: there will be a new enemy called a Wendigo.

Inspiration: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendigo

lol wat?

Why not make cannibals transform into dogmen instead of wendigos? This would also explain where all the dogmen are coming from.

Ran around with a clown mask before it was cool

The wendigos are humanoid in apearance and is more believable that cannibals lose their minds than turn into dogmen.

lol wat?

You said the magic word :)

I had wendigo on my cryptid wishlist, but I actually hadn't considered wendigo psychosis as a solution to the cannibalism balance problem. Very clever!

I'd have to reconcile the wendigo with the fact that Zom Zom's and other cannibal factions exist in human form, but it's still a possibility. Now I'll have to mull that over...

Dan Fedor - Founder, Blue Bottle Games

I like the idea but there are a few creatures that leave behind a humanoid corpse even though they are obviously non-human, like the Enfield Horror. Would eating meat from these creatures still result in Wendigo status even though it isn't actually cannibalism?

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*Waits patiently for the addition of Carroltron*

Butchering Enfield Horrors could yield spoiled meat indicating it's a kind of an undead.

Ran around with a clown mask before it was cool

On what basis do you claim they are undead? They never occurred to me as such...


<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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But neither the Melonheads or Enfield Horrors are undead, so what would be the point?

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*Waits patiently for the addition of Carroltron*

I just thought of an idea that might work. Wendigo is a disease that only affects certain human individuals. most of the current population of Michigan have a natural immunity to Wendigo but are still carriers of the strain. Philip Kindred, being a man from the past, did not develop an immunity to the disease. When carving up a corpse, there is a chance that some or all of the meat will be infected with Wendigo. Only medics will be able to tell the difference between the meats.

Also just because I am a zombie fan, if bitten by a Wendigo, you get level 1 Wendigo.

Hope this helps you "mull" Dan (:

Oh and regarding differentiating between corpses, Enfield horror corpse should be renamed grotesque corpse so any monstrous creatures would yield this type of corpse. Wendigos are/used to be humans and melon heads look as though they themselves used to be human so they would drop human corpses

lol wat?

For the sake of balancing and incorporating guys at Zom Zom, I'd just make the condition only be attributed to meat from the humans player murdererd himself in the wastes. Some sort of improvised mystical explanation could be that not only not everyone turns into wendigo, having different world-view - what ZeeOvenfresh suggested, with possibly backing of (true or not) theories that times the character comes from are closer to ours, where no matter personal preferences and standpoint, it's assumed by at least millions that cannibalism is both evil and taboo, so everyone who will practice it willingly for longer time are also evil and will face consequences (could be tied with your idea of affecting reality through subconsciousness) - and possibly different psycho-physical condition.

That being said, there could be some wendigo among Zom Zom guys - a constant internal threat they have to isolate and eliminate if they notice not every one of them is responding well over longer period of time, with some of them known to be so, but allowed to hang around as long as they get their human burgers only from time to time to not get worse. Just a sub-event and few lines of dialogue would be enough, a warning to the player that until he'll make sure he can dig in without consequences, he shouldn't overuse Zom Zom's offer lest one day he may go crazy, get a bullet and finish as a meal himself.

We shouldn't make the condition game over at level 2 though (it would be, as it forces the player to continue plowing deeper into cannibalism, thus making it worse), just balanced. For example,[list]
[*]I'd leave first level on just a fluff message that the food tastes dull - unless you'll eat piece of human meat.
[*]At level 2 the pain condition - so player can still turn back from his cannibal ways - it will be harder, but possible.
[*]At third I'd make character remove random piece of clothing from time to time, with a message of how uncomfortable it is and how he cannot handle it anymore. That, combined with previous effects will already make it very hard to survive without preparations and some safe place to 'detox' full of food.
[*]Fourth could be aforementioned need to eat human flesh as the only filling food - a possible countdown to doom because the character would probably would starve himself to death if attempting to stop being a cannibal. Maybe there would be some last chance with an old shaman or some such who could offer his help at the stage 4, but only once - if player goes wendigo again, too bad. It's at this level, rather than DMC, it should be superstititious/folk-knowledge people of the sprawl outside of the wall who would gather up and tell the character to go away or else - with options of very-small-chance of sneaking around them before and after conversation or attempt of just killing the group (which should be very hard - say, full squad of looters, with equipment randomized from rags and sticks to fur clothes and loaded guns).
[*]Fifth is game over with proper fluff scene before it.

I'm against getting the condition from bites, unless at very low chance and no matter how many such bites will be given - the condition will never get further than level 1 on it's own. Otherwise a few fights can lead to the end of the game no matter how well the character does, which would be simply awful from both the standpoint of balance and gameplay experience for many.

Time needed to kick the condition down a level probably would have to be considerably long, especially at higher levels (say, week at level one, with one more week more each new level). For gaining wendigo condition ranks though - a dozen of human meals maybe per one such time period. This way cannibalism is viable way to ensure survival if player wants his character to indulge in it, but one won't be able to sustain himself solely on such for longer without facing the consequences.

I really like this idea, as it fits nicely into the world's both lore and game-play.

The mechanics Scavenger proposes are looking fine, and I agree with his "stages". I do think however that if this affliction is to have an actual impact on the game it should grow faster, only a few days from stage one to stage two and a month total before players doom, otherwise to will be too slow for many to live until, and experience, the last part.

As for the part of why ZomZomers are not all monsters at this point - maybe sticking to the actual, real folklore would be sufficient. Wendigo is (according to Wikipedia's article at least) a kind of evil spirit, related to starvation and excess at the same time, and would only affect people who would voluntarily eat other person to survive. Folks at ZZ's are not starving crowd who is being fed obviously human flesh. They are eating BBQ at a sports arena (of sorts) with "I don't give a f**k" attitude - hardly an act of desperation, even if one is guided by a hunger into doing so. And I assume that the place's management and staff do not participate in the act at all. Unless there is a ideological cannibal among them who does that on purpose as he would be suspect to the curse, I suppose.

Another reason can be that, going with the "belief makes reality" rule, with enough guests at ZZ's believing they are being served a legit meat, the meat itself becomes actually a "generic meat" at some point of it's preparation.


<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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I guess we might say, eating only human flesh would cause this disease, and Zom Zom provides human and animal meats on and off, to avoid arousing suspicion?
Just an idea, I guess that'd ruin the whole theme of the place, but I would feel just as disturbed by the fact that you are being human meat on occasions by Zom Zom.

A.K.A DapperDogman. Smashing.
Do you like my mask? It's a cool new toy I found.

I believe cannibalism needs to be nerfed and the idea of Wendigo's goes very nicely with the supernatural themes of the game, however I don't think the trait should kill you and end the game. I believe that Wendigo's should function similarly to the character normally; but they can ONLY eat human meat as well as being shunned by all groups (except Wendigo's factions.) I think the idea of a human hunter is an interesting idea and if any of you have read the walking dead comics I thought 'The Hunters' was a interesting idea and would love to see these kinds of people living in the world in the more remote and hostile areas of the map.

Hahahaha!!!!! I'm dying right now over how awesomely inhuman, ghastly...and freaking awesome this idea is XD. It will be like being a vampire in Oblivion. It has it's downsides but is so much fun. Please implement this into the game!!!

*Throws IPad and picks up Razer Tablet*

It's really a great idea. First off getting food with cannibalism is far too simple and You get punished by it only once:

Spoiler: Highlight to view
in Junk market(after one warning!)

Secondly it will add kind of mythical zombie/vampire flavour quite fitting the game world as Caberfries mentioned. Wendigo plot lines and faction could be cool for sure.

I have some suggestions also. Maybe add some more scientific approach to the subject? The idea of having mental illnesses in game is generally nice but there is real fatal, incurable (nowadays) disease caused by cannibalism:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuru_(disease)
It could be connected to Wendigo condition (as 3rd state with shaking hands nerfing combat skills [ & additional possible conversation outputs with recognising Cannibal!] and 4th with painfull death) or standalone disease caused by eating human flesh.

Nevertheless Wendigo idea is great and I'm looking forward to it!

Actually, it is partially in the game already.

Spoiler: Highlight to view
The player's character, if he continuously eats human flesh, will become more and more gluttonous, ending up with hunger so big that his nutrition bar will drop much faster than the thirst bar usually does. But it's a process that takes some time, it does not happens over night (about two weeks +, depending on random factor and how often does player actually eats his "special" meals).

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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I never ate human meat but i ate a lot of dogman meat and made it to "ready to advance to wendigo 2" didnt know until i died when i couldnt beat off the third dogman to attack me up north. didnt notice a difference.

Mitch
"Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men" Colossians 3:23
visit http://www.youtube.com/user/mrjman13

Dogmen don't count as people, so you must have eaten a human at some point...

Spoiler: Highlight to view
Maybe you've been to ZomZoms too many times? Cause their BBQ is made from those who loose at the robot fights :D

<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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oh i didn't know their meat was human, will be more careful in future. are there any benefits to becoming a wendigo?

Mitch
"Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men" Colossians 3:23
visit http://www.youtube.com/user/mrjman13

None that I am aware of. It is a curse, after all.


<--Mighty (mini)Mod of Doom-->
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My first few long-lasting playthroughs were when I found out about Wendigo. I was just chowing down on some Bad Mutha after dragging them into the forest to see the event that initiates the wendigo sequence. I got curious after reading it and showed no mercy to almost every baddy out there just to eat them over a stick fire (I usually go for good karma since friendlies will fend off hostiles even if you aren't there and just so I feel good once I die in the game.) Long story short I fell for the Wendigo's foxy techniques much easier than I expected and only came here after seeing I was in the third stage in the death screen.. ._.

Roses are red,
Been playing so great,
Your whole body is in an inflammatory, 'potentially' fatal state.